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Activity Stream

  1. Jezz added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    I'm pleased to hear that Jim is on the mend, albeit slowly. What we do carries an inherent risk, and sometimes that risk exceeds our ability to manage it (for whatever reason). That is when we have no choice but to accept that the outcome is going to be down to luck and fate. For Jim it seems that fate has taken a positive turn, not so for Joey's friend.

    As one single community, I think I can speak for us all when I say that our thoughts and prayers are always with those who's ability to manage the risks of flying has been outstripped and now in the hands of fate.

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  2. dholly added a post in a topic KF III rigging   


    It sounds like we have the same M-III 'Manual', more like a mish-mosh of earlier manuals with lots of revisions and even 'final installments' of the M-IV manual. At first I thought it was an improvement over my sketchy Avid Mk-IV manual but, after going thru it all, I dunno...

    In any event, you're right, CF-17 refers to left wing lift strut as non-adjustable. However, Step (24) pg. W-21 of the 1 Sept 90 M-III Manual says to install (4) rod ends etc. Also, the rigging info I have on pgs CF-17 and CF-18 are for Model "Kitfox" (with no model # designation), pg. CF-17 is noted Revision 2 and dtd 19 Nov 85, and pg. CF-18 has blank revision or date notations. If the pg just says Kitfox with no model designation, I assumed it was for earlier models. That does call into question the 'instructions' on pg. CF-18, as well as the continuation of Steps (71) and (72) on it's backside, pg. CF-19. Interestingly, my pg. CF-19 says Kitfox M-II, Spinner Assembly, Rev.3, 31 Aug 89 but contains only the flaperon rigging info.

    Clearly, the manual is light on info but I agree with Leni's 15* degree suggestion. Most everything I've read leads to it. The original builder of my M-III penciled in copious notes and, on Fig. CF-12, he drew in flaperon down deflection of 0*-23* degrees from neutral but I intend to check deflection and reduce to 0*-15* degrees if necessary.

    A couple other items to note:

    - a short blurb in the attached Kitfox Owner Newsletter states: "The flaperons neutral position, as shown in Fig. CF-12 page CF-18 of the construction manual, can be safely set at 1-3/4" below the front spar. This may greatly facilitate the rest of the rigging procedure."

    - when setting flaperons to neutral, the fuse leveling procedure is on pg. F-21 of the 01 Nov 90 M-III Manual, took me a while to find it and it is different than leveling procedure for later Kitfox models or the Avid.

    - post by another M-III owner: "When I got my model III the flaperons were set so that a deflection of the ailerons would cause the flaperon setting to reduce to about half. I thought that was probably putting unnecessary stress on the mixing box so I adjusted the flaperon so it would just start to reduce the flaperon setting with full aileron deflection. The results of this adjustment were: the flaperons can now be used as a slight attitude adjuster... The nose goes up slightly with flaperons fully retracted. As for the use of the flaps I noticed no difference at all."

    I saved some info when rigging my Avid Mk-IV. Because the KF-III and Avid have an almost identical mixer and flaperon setup, it may be helpful for you. Just keep in mind, part numbers are different but rigging procedure will be similar.

    - post by another Avid owner: "Thinking it over, I dug out the destructions and there was an update! This plane and others with “flaperons†use a mechanical contraption to provide aileron control and flap, but in reality, they are “Trimerons†as using too much flap input reduces the effect of the aileron control and will cause control reversal with too much flap deflection. AVID warns not to use more than 15* degrees, but they also suggest starting with a negative 6* degrees to provide more trim effect, rather than use the elevator trim. The verbiage also said that this would make the aileron control HEAVY! AHAH..... back to the first set of blurb, and they say to use minus 3* degrees, which I reset them to. I also made certain I had just 13* degrees of travel, as the flaps don't work like conventional do."

    The following is credited (with many thanks) to Graham Laucht:

    "This is the text from a note I wrote for our locals builders several years ago to help identify the necessary steps in setting up the flight controls particularly the flaperons. The builder's manual never quite seemed to deal with the essentials.

    Flaperon rigging

    1.. Assemble the Control Column so each control stick (F16) is parallel with its neighbour. Adjust the length of the Connecting link F18 to arrive at this point.
    2.. Check the angular movement of the control stick is equal each side of centre (+/-30 degrees). Trim any excess metal from the "doghouse" if necessary.
    3.. Assemble the U joint assembly F47, F5, F39 etc and temporarily assembly the Front Bellcrank F5. Check that in the full range of the control stick the U joint remains free and is not bound up or in contact with the Control Column Housing F15. Re-assemble the link assemblies, change bolts to Clevis heads if this helps. Cutting off the port end of F15 at approximately 45 degrees helps eliminate a lot of foul ups with the moving parts. Placing packing beneath the half round wooden supports and the end pivot bracket might help in obtaining smooth motion. Adjust the vertical position of the front bellcrank with washers if necessary.
    4.. Temporarily assemble the F19(A) Aileron push pull tube with the front rod end joint F40 and lay the tube so that the aft end is near the aft bellcrank but disconnected. Ensure the rod end bolt doesn't foul with the carpet or floorboards.
    5.. Adjust the links F38 & F39 until the relative movements of the push pull tube are equal for control stick deflection.
    6.. Assemble Bellcrank F6 to the Aileron push pull tube and with the control stick locked in the vertical position adjust the rod end fitting F40 until the bellcrank pivot bolt and output link forms a line parallel with the mixer pivot bolt.
    7.. Hopefully by now the angular rotation of the F6 bellcrank is equal about this imaginary parallel line for deflections of the control stick. If not adjust the fitting either side of the front bellcrank until this is satisfied.
    8.. Assemble the mixer pivot arm F1 and connect the male and female rod end fittings F39 and F38 adjusting them so that with the control stick vertical the mixer pivot arm is perfectly horizontal. Check that the angular rotation of the pivot arm is equal about the horizontal for deflections of the control stick.
    9.. Now connect the Flaperon bell cranks F7 to the mixer arm with the male and female rod ends F37 and F38 from the flap bellcrank F8. Initially adjust them so that the Flaperon bell crank inboard arms are parallel with the mixer arm. Check with the control stick locked vertically that the Flaperon bell cranks are parallel by laying a straightedge across them. Adjust the rod end links from the flap bellcrank until this is true. Check the angular movement of each flaperon bell crank is equal for control stick deflection. That is to say that the amount of up travel matches that of the opposite arm and likewise the amount of down travel. Because of slight differential action here the amounts of up and down travel are unequal.
    10.. Assemble the Flaperon push pull tubes F21 and temporarily fix the Vertical swivels F51 etc so that the Flaperons can be connected.
    11.. With the stick locked in the middle the neutral angle of each flaperon must be equal. If not adjust the length of the push pull tube by adding AN4 washers between the push pull tube and the swivel. If gross errors are adjusted by altering the lengths of the threaded rods F37 then the mixer will be unbalanced.
    12.. Check the angular movement of the flaperons is equal for deflection of the control stick. Again the movement up and down will differ due to a degree of differential action.
    13.. Finally set the flap handle in the neutral position so the top end of the flap bellcrank is parallel with the mixer pivot bolt. Use the Flap push pull tube F10(A) F40 rod end to make this adjustment.
    14.. Adjust the threaded links equally until the flaperons are set to zero degrees incidence and check the actual angles. Pull the flap handle until with the control stick locked vertical the flaperons droop by 15* degrees and adjust the stop bolt.
    15.. Check the angular movement is equal for deflection of the control stick allowing for differences due to differential action.
    16.. Fit the turtledecks and check that the movements are equal and not affected by excess friction from the nylon bearings.
    17.. Eliminate any lost motion through slack or loose bolt assemblies and similarly remove any source of binding or excess friction from the system.

    This is an ideal situation but takes no account of build errors particularly in locating the flaperon hinges on the wing ribs. Similarly inexact drilling of the
    U joint blocks F2 can throw out the accuracy of the system. Sometimes compromises have to be made to ensure the wings fold properly.

    - This text is from another missive on identifying potential problems:

    Normal problems are generally a failure to assure the system is working symmetrically due to errors in the cockpit assemblies or in the mixer main arm. If this area is remedied then often the residual problems are soluble. One problem that is not easy to solve is due to dynamic changes to the rigging in flight. One example in particular trued out on the ground but was a nightmare when airborne. This turned out to be additional friction in the flaperon bearings and especially the turtledeck bearings which was developed asymmetrically in flight. Ground checks showed appropriate opposite flaperon deflection with stick input but airborne only one flaperon was downgoing on one side but upgoing on both. The result was very poor control harmony and a lethal turning stall characteristic where instead of the aircraft rolling out of the stalled wing it rolled in.

    Another showed unusual pitch effects with roll control and was found due to gross errors in drilling the front spar carry through holes resulting in one
    wing being swept back and the other swept forward. Simple test for imbalance, time the period between rolling from 30 degree bank left to right and the other way about. It should be the same. At approximately 70mph with the stick held central pull on the flap lever in stages and determine
    which way the aircraft rolls. It should remain wings level and only pitch down. Yawing or rolling would imply imbalance.

    Stall the aircraft clean and with flaps set. It should stall straight ahead or have similar benign characteristics at any setting. This assumes the port wing strut rod end bearing has been adjusted to eliminate any nasty wing dropping tendencies.

    Stall the aircraft in gentle co-ordinated banked turns with various degrees of flaperon set and ensure it rolls level and does not have any tendency to "tuck in" to the turn.

    Ensure that at maximum flap setting there is no tendency to control reversal or asymmetric stall. Experience has shown that this may occur above 15* degrees on some examples."

    Graham Laucht
    Hope that helps some.

    [edit] wrong attachment
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  3. racegunz added a topic in Avidfoxflyers General Hangar   

    40 hrs phase one is done!
    Thanks in part to the members here helping me iron out my tach problem I have finished my phase one testing, I finished today with a 2 hour flight starting at dawn and power -on and off stalls and slow flight,(they do go hand in hand). I have a couple of quick clips on youtube under the same user name I have here if you want to take a look. Fly safe!
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  4. dholly added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    Thank you for any prayers and positive thoughts offered, I believe they are working. As of this a.m., Jim is now critical but stable. After another surgery Sun., doctors finally located and stopped the internal bleeding. His facial injuries are limited to lacerations, not facial fractures as originally assessed, and one leg is not broken. He must endure two more immediate orthopedic surgeries and will remain in an induced coma until sometime next week to help his body heal. He is not yet out of the woods but for the first time I sense optimism in the email updates from the hospital. Barring any complications, it sounded like he will be in the ICU for at least 3 more weeks then moved to a recovery room for another 3 weeks before starting rehabilitation therapy. It will be a long and difficult recovery but he is strong and fortunate to be a survivor at this point. I have absolutely no doubt he will be flying as soon as physically able. Again, thank you and please keep him in your thoughts.
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  5. akflyer added a post in a topic KF III rigging   

    Sounds like the manual you have is still talking about the model II where the left strut was fixed and you could only adjust the right wing. The initial twist in the wing is built in. Just make sure that you level the fuse and wings per the manual and make both sides match for initial flights (if you find that it wont fly level hands off you can adjust one wing or the other to get it perfect). As far as the flaperon action, you should set the flaps for a maximum of 15 degrees, and what ever you get for aileron action is what you get. It is easier to do all your adjusting now before the plane is covered than once it is done. I finished mine in the winter time and did not have room in the garage to put both wings on so I did the final after it was covered and it makes it a little tougher to get to some of the bolts, but not too bad if you pull the seat out.

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  6. egp8111 added a topic in KitFox General Forum   

    KF III rigging
    I'm working on the final rigging of a KF III rebuild project before I start covering. Seems the instructions in the builders manual are pretty skimpy or maybe it's just me. Is there any information on the amount of travel(in degrees) the flapperons should have when functioning as ailerons/flaps? Do you just set it up the way they say and get what you get? I'm also having trouble understanding why they say the left wing is non-adjustable it has the same rod ends as the right wing, do the mean you just adjust the right wing to match the left. Any ideas, suggestions ?
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  7. horsepower added a post in a topic Idaho less than a week away!   

    Awesome Joey, wish my plane was done and the 40 flown off and I was going with you.I have buddies here that fly down there quite a bit and they it is beautiful.Have a great flight and watch for elk and moose on the runway. Randy
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  8. dholly added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    I hesitate to pile on this thread but have another pilot in desperate need. My friend is critical with multiple lacerations and internal injuries, shattered pelvis, broken bones, but most serious he was impaled by a bamboo longeron (the structure of the aircraft was made of bamboo) that left a puncture wound as large as a fist. After 24 hours, 2 surgeries and 60 units of blood the bleeding is still not controlled. Please offer a prayer for Jim and strength for his family. Thank you. News Pics
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  9. akflyer added a post in a topic Idaho less than a week away!   

    should be a great trip! good luck and keep us posted. The 180 sounds awesome. I love the fly by, sounds like a fighter coming at you! The only time I hate that sound is when I'm out on the river camping and some D.bag thinks he has to leave camp at 5 am

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  10. C5Engineer added a topic in Avidfoxflyers General Hangar   

    Idaho less than a week away!
    Next Wed I'm leaving on the my greatest flying adventure to date. A guy in a Rans S-7 and I are flying from the Bay Area here in California to Johnson Creek in Idaho. It's about 480NM each way plus whatever we put in while were there. We are planning on flying out to some of the gnarlier Idaho strips on Thur and Friday. Were hoping to make it all the way on Wednesday. It's about 9 hours enroute if we can keep 60kts groundspeed. I've been planning this trip for years and years. I can't believe it's finally here. The weather forcast is looking promising so far. Here is a link to the route and a video of the famous Mile Hi. Looking at it, it looks easy to land. The gotcha is the Density Altitude will be in the neighborhood of 8000ft up there. The old 582 is gonna be gasping.

    Westover Field to Johnson Creek
    Video of Mile Hi Love the sound of a 180 winding up

    A shot of the approach into Johnson Creek

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  11. Jezz added a post in a topic Some cool old toys   


    Just stumbled across this thread while I am sitting on the ground waiting for a warm front to pass through ... i.e. killing today and hoping tomorrow will bring some good CAVOK.

    Anyway, I recognize nearly all of these models and think I probably own a few of them. The London bus in particular looks really familiar.

    I will be in the UK week after next, so if I get a few minutes free I will climb up into the attic and have a look.

    I think you are probably on the money with dating them in the 80s. I picked up most of mine during my reprobate years through to about 88.

    I will keep you posted and try to bring some pics back too.

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  12. dholly added a post in a topic NE AvidFoxFlyer Skunk[y beer] Works   

    No, not related. However, if you just happen to spy a spankin' new 912 hanging on the Avid+ sometime soon you'll know why hehe...
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  13. akflyer added a post in a topic Buying my new Avid   

    to pull the tops off the carbs, you just take out the two screws on the top and pull the slide out. There is a spring that is inside the slide, you will have to pull the spring up, then push down on the cable to get the cable ferule out of the carb slide. Once you pull the slide you should be able to see how it goes very easily. The clip should be on the 3rd notch from the bottom. If you need to set it to the bottom notch, I would say you need more pitch in the prop if the jets are the correct size per the rotax chart.

    I have the IVO 72" 3 blade ultralight prop with In flight adjust. If you dont want the extra expence, you can go with the ground adjust as they are the easiest prop to set the pitch on. No protractor just turn one adjustment screw and all 3 blades change pitch at the same time.

    Max HP on the 582 is about 6200 and max tq is right at 6000, they both fall off pretty damn quick after those RPM figures. I have noted that much over 6300 RPM my climb falls off pretty quick, so I tend to load the prop pretty good. I need about 6250 or 6300 to get out on step with the floats at gross weight, but as the take off run progresses, I feed in more pitch to keep the RPM around 61-6200 It only takes a bump or two of the switch to keep the RPM right where I want it throughout the flight. If the EGTs are climbing, just a bump in pitch takes care of that.

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  14. Jezz added a post in a topic Buying my new Avid   

    Leni, thanks for that.

    I do not yet know which notch I am on - I have not had the tops off the carbs (basically because I could not find a manual on how to do it). I have watched the Rotax training video for the 912 Bing adjustment - will the 582 be similar?

    The prop is a wooden Peery prop - I have no idea what the figures are for it, but I believe it is the original as installed in the aircraft.

    Which VP prop do you have? Is it CS or straight VP? The wooden prop on mine looks great, but I guess it will be in line for replacement sooner or later (there is some separation of the varnish layer on one tip (although this does not cause me any vib problems at all and the varnish is smooth edged where it is separated so I am not too worried).

    As for the 50 hour, I was also going to clean the air filer (again! it doesnt seem like 5 minutes since I last cleaned it on the way from England). I will probably wait until these last 6 hours are complete before going into the carbs - as things are I can keep things in check (just), but Latvia is full of huge fields and meadows so if it all goes wrong I just pull the power and land

    Many thanks again

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  15. akflyer added a post in a topic NE AvidFoxFlyer Skunk[y beer] Works   

    I knew it was below the belt.. I'll take the penatly points and keep laughing Nice to hear the local logger is not laughing! hmm... is that how a certain little yellow kitfox came to be

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  16. akflyer added a post in a topic Buying my new Avid   

    I would say you need more pitch. 6700 straight and level is a bit too much. I set my prop for 6500 max straight and level then start backing off the power (I have an inflight ajustable prop). If the EGTs go down as you climb then you are too lean at low level. What main jets are you running? If you have the clip on the lowest notch in the needle then you may need to change needles and needle jet. What prop do you have and what are your main jets?

    As far as a 50 hr tear down, I would do nothing more than change plugs and look in the exhaust ports and do a compression check.

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  17. akflyer added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    I too have lost alot of friends to accidents. It is a way of life up here. After my accident, I didnt fly for awhile, then when I did get back in the air, I was mr. cautious for the first 10 hrs or so, but then the old feelings soon came back and I was back down on the deck swamp running and not even thinking about what could go wrong (to a certain extent). I am allways looking for suitable landing areas, and not taking huge risks, but if the terrain allows, you can be the wheels (or floats) are not more than a couple feet off the ground.

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  18. Jezz added a post in a topic Buying my new Avid   

    Hey Leni

    It took me a couple of days to wait for weather, women and will to get up.

    Static was a bit over 6100 - from fully warmed up, water about 185 F and EGTs within limits, but I didnt keep it there as the I was a bit concerned about the water.
    S&L flight RPM was 6700 (although it was as turbulent as hell so there may have been some residual RPMs in there from the conditions) - Water about 185, EGT about 1200 F max (although I have seen it trying to peak higher than this - as soon as I see it is heading that way I am back on the throttle.

    During climbs at low altitude I am seeing the water temps heading up above 180, by the time I am up to 3000' that is solved.
    Also, at 3000' AMSL things are a lot better with the EGTs.

    At 1000' AMSL and 6100 RPM in straight and level I have about 180 water and 1200 EGT
    At 1000' AMSL and 6000 RPM in Straight and level I have about 175 water but the EGT tries to edge its way above 1200, which I can either adding more RPM, or taking a climb.
    At 1000' AMSL and 5800 RPM in Straight and level the water temp is well within range, but the EGT goes up really fast and if I don't catch it in time I am forced to pull the throttle and descend.

    At 3000' AMSL and 6100 RPM in straight and level the water was still about 180 but the EGT was down slightly to about 1150
    At 3000' AMSL and 5800 RPM in normal straight and level flight, water about 165 and EGTs back up to 1200
    At 3000' AMSL and 5800 RPM in reverse power command (i.e. nose somewhere pointing to heaven and anchoring on to the stall), everything settled down - water 160ish and EGTs down to 1050.

    So, any thoughts? Is this an indication that I am running too lean? Should I change my jets? Change the notch for the needle? (lowest notch is richest isn't it?).

    I am due for a 50 hour check in about 6 hours, so I shall be spending quite a bit of time learning the engine - we should also get our new hangar on the airfield (an old fire station garage - plenty of room for an Avid ) by that stage.

    Anything special I should look out for during the 50 hour check? I have the Rotax manual which I am going to spend a bit of time with before taking the baby apart.

    OK, that's it for now - I have had my hopes of flying tomorrow crushed by the director of the CAA (I have to come to the office tomorrow), and by the weather forecast - looking like the proverbial !

    In advance, thanks guys - all thoughts welcomed!

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  19. Jezz added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    Hi Joey

    I'm pleased you took me up on the suggestion - I remember being just as cautious after my first.

    It is perfectly normal that your confidence takes a hit when you have lost someone who you knew well, and who you considered to be a good pilot. I remember after my first I spent the biggest part of the flight thinking about everything that could go wrong with the aircraft, with my piloting etc. Just a few flights later and everything was back to normal for me. I hope you get back to 100% confidence soon!

    dholly, I think what we are talking about is the hit that your confidence can take. I have, over the years lost many friends to accidents, 1 midair, 1 in-flight breakup, 1 during a display, several through very poor decision making resulting in pilot error accidents. After each of them I spend some time looking over what I could improve to ensure I do not end up in the same boat, but what I do now is not a patch on the mulling and musing that I did after the first. Had I not gotten straight back into the thick of it after the first, I think I know I would have started to analyze which would have caused me to worry which would have made me analyze more and so on. It may have been that I would never have gotten my confidence back to where it was before had I not taken the bull by the horns.

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  20. dholly added a post in a topic NE AvidFoxFlyer Skunk[y beer] Works   

    Oh man that was a friggin good laugh Leni! I can't believe you remembered that. Definitely down and to the inside as far as jokes go but, suffice to say, the little logger next door ain't laughing any more.

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  21. akflyer added a post in a topic NE AvidFoxFlyer Skunk[y beer] Works   

    Damn nice digs there Mr. Bet the privacy would be better with a few extra trees on the hill side OK so that may have been below the belt... but this is the AFF site so you should expect it by now!

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  22. dholly added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    One thing I have noticed after fatal plane crashes is that a lot -and I mean A LOT- of folks, both pilots and non-pilots alike, say it's best for pilot friends to "get right back on the horse again". It certainly may be the best advice but I don't really understand why. After losing my friends, I never once thought about giving up flying. In fact it only made the resolve to finish my build or buy a plane even stronger, as one never knows when his/her time will come. Hell, I'm not getting any younger and owning my own plane and having the ability to go flying whenever I want has been at the top of my 'bucket list' for a very long time. Of course events like this effect everyone differently, but I wonder how many who lost a loved one in an auto accident ever considered simply giving up driving? You can argue that driving is a practical necessity while flying is simply a leisure activity but, really, is it optional or so easy for most pilots to walk from flying? I do wonder. The time, training, expense and sacrifices of becoming a pilot and aircraft owner is an investment made by a few select and very dedicated individuals, and I suspect 99.9% of them who have not already voluntarily hung up the headset continue to fly out of a love and passion so strong it is nearly impossible to extinguish. We do fly on after unexpected tragedies such as this, and becoming better, more appreciative pilots for it is the best way to remember our friends. Give support to the families who may or may not have fully understood their passion. And don't forget to invite your friend to fly along with you in spirit now and again on a particularly beautiful day, he would appreciate that.
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  23. dholly added a post in a topic NE AvidFoxFlyer Skunk[y beer] Works   

    Well Russ, all I can say is after working myself silly for the past 30 years, at least I got something to show for it... like a big fat mortgage!
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  24. Av8r3400 added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    Joey-- I know where you are right now.

    Don't stop, keep flying. (was my mistake...) Do this for your friend, he would want it this way.

    Remember your family and be safe, but don't stop the joy of what you have started. In his memory.

    My sympathy, prayers and thoughts to you and theirs...
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  25. C5Engineer added a post in a topic Lost a friend to an accident yesterday   

    Thanks everyone! Jezz thanks for the suggestion. I took you up on it and went flying for a bout 30 mins. This has hit me pretty hard. After the most thorough preflight and the most conservative approach and landing I've done in a long time I felt alot better.
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