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Good lord it's no wonder two-strokes get a bad rap

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Posted

I just spent a while reading thru the Rotax-Owner forum, specifically the two-stroke area. Reading some of the "issues" people were having were mind blowing. I'm no expert by any means as you guys know by my silly questions sometimes, but common sense goes a long ways. Just about every thread on there concreted my theory that almost all the issues people have with 2-strokes are caused by not having any idea how they work or how to plumb one properly. If they would learn that they can't treat them like a Briggs and Stratton motor they would have a lot better luck with them.

 

Just a few of many examples

 

 

I have a C gearbox on my 582. Whoever put the drain plug on before I bought it really put it on tight. Is there a good way to remove it?

Is it imperial or metric? Looks like 11/16 and 17mm both fit.
 

If you can't figure out if a bolt is metric or standard you probably outta be paying someone else to work on your crap for you!

 

I want to buy some gearbox oil for the 582 (mod 99) but I can't find it. The Rotax manual is explicit about the TYPE: API-GL5/GL6, SAE 140 EP, 85W-

140 EP. But I can't find any actual brands to buy.
 

Did you try a place that actually sells oil? I had no idea that gear oil was hard to find.

 

My Rotax 582 mod 99 has a fuel "pulse line" running from the fuel pump to the engine block.

Can anyone tell me what the pulse line does?

 

At least this guy is trying to learn how it works.

 

 Between the Rotax manual and CPS's catalog tech articles you can learn ALOT! I wonder how many of these same people gave up with their 2-stroke and then went and told all their Lycoming operating buddies how terrible of an engine they are because you can't just turn the key and go for 1500 hrs with nothing but oil changes.

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Posted

 I do think there's a sometimes unstated deal that if you're going to fly a two-stroke, you have to learn a lot about them.  My first years of flying were in 152's and 172's at FBO's and a flying club.  I learned next to zero about their powerplants.  It wasn't encouraged and it wasn't necessary.  This may carry over to folks who purchase ready made LSA's with 912's and similar.  Many of these just need their annual and regular oil changes and away they go.  If they avoid the low RPM gearbox chatter area, they'll probably have a good experience with little in-depth knowledge.

 

I can't imagine trying to fly a two stroke that way, it just wouldn't work.  I'm not unhappy with mine, but I've still got a bit of climbing to do on the knowledge curve.  I'm just over a hundred hours on my 582 and it hasn't burped. farted or gone silent on me while in the air.  I'm building confidence with every flight.

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Posted

Paul I think you are right. 2-strokes are definitly not turn key. I think a lot of people buy a used plane and think they can just jump in and go. There was one guy on there who was fouling plugs and 2 pages later they finally figured out that it had oil injection and he had also been premixing the fuel because that's what a buddy told him to do. He was running 25:1 and then some. Had no idea it was oil injected. You would think that reservoir and plumbing would have made him curious but I guess not. At least someone told him to mix the gas or eventually it probably would have burned up when it ran out of oil. There's no way I would buy a two stroke powered LSA that someone else built without going through it with a fine toothed comb before trying to fly it but that's just me the inquisitive rocket scientist :hammerhead:

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Posted

I was raised with a father who owned 15 auto shops. When he passed away my mother remarried a few years later to great guy who went to embry riddle and had been a mechanic his whole life. He recently passed as well. Rest in peace to both of them.

I suppose I was fortunate to be raised with a lot of mechanical knowledge but it is really amazing to me how many people I run across nowadays who cannot change a spark plug or do an oil change. I'm in the business of building custom jeeps and sell alot of jeep parts too. Unfortunately when I sell a part to a local their vehicle usually comes back about 2 weeks later all screwed up. It's just amazing to me.

I have had conversations with local pilots who just do not know how a carbureted 4 stroke engine works. Let alone a 2 stroke. You should see their faces when I am rebuilding a Mazda rotary! Mind = Blown! Haha

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Posted

Do you know if the Mike Stratman articles are still up on the CPS site?  I had downloaded most of them to my lap top, but I am having issues with it right now and she don't want to fire up.  His articles were the closest thing to a "how to fly a 2 stroke for dummies" book.  It would be nice to get the full set of them posted up here to make it easier for the guys to find and read.

 

I am with you, I would bet that over 90% of 2 stroke engine failures are due to operator error and could have been prevented with just a little bit of education.

 

:BC:

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Posted

I was one of those asking stupid questions.  I believe I was asking questions that may have appeared very simple but I have a certain level of paranoia when messing with an aircraft engine.  There are things that logically I probably could have answered my own question.  But sure enough as soon as I assumed something then it could be a fatal mistake.  I hope that you guys don't get irritated with me in the future as I know that I will ask some stupid question.  I would much rather appear air headed than 6 foot under with my wife wondering what to do next.

 

I do agree that there are some scary simple people out there who make you hold your breath hoping they make it through the next phase of learning to fly.

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Posted

Everyone has to learn. There are no stupid questions.

There are some stupid questioners though... :)

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Posted

I have asked alot of silly questions as well and I appreciate everyone's patience on here. I was worried this message would get misconstrued somewhat. It's one thing if someone is actively attempting to learn, but its a whole another when they go out there and do something silly because of a lack of education and then blame the equipment and not themselves for the results. That is the point I was trying to make. Lots of people are two stroke haters simply because another person told them they sucked because they couldn't make their engine work for them. If I forget to put oil in my lycoming and it grenades itself does that mean that all Lycomings are bad?? I wasn't trying to make these guys out to be morons even though looking back at my orginal post I can certainly see that it could be taken that way.

 

While I'm thinking about it does anyone know what those long things sticking out to the sides of a plane are for? :blink:

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Posted

I think those are designed to catch trees when you get too close to them.  I think someone should try to take them off and fly without them!  :lmao:

 

:BC:

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Posted (edited)

The articles are still there as of 9/28/2014  But the addressability has gotten more tricky:  The address listed above is no longer valid. Use one of these: 

 

Easy way  www.cps-parts    when it opens go to the search box and type in Articles. A list will appear and the Rotax series is first.

 

Difficult way  http://www.cps-parts.com/catalog/rtxpages/articles.php?clickkey=581891  This may work or you could get a "can't find server" message.  

 

Before you start you need to know there are 63 articles. I respectfully suggest that you NOT start with "Servicing the Gear Box". In addition to a massive headache it will convince you to never remove the gearbox from the engine.  

Edited by 1wise1
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Posted

The articles are still there as of 9/28/2014  But the addressability has gotten more tricky:  The address listed above is no longer valid. Use one of these: 

 

Easy way  www.cps-parts    when it opens go to the search box and type in Articles. A list will appear and the Rotax series is first.

 

Difficult way  http://www.cps-parts.com/catalog/rtxpages/articles.php?clickkey=581891  This may work or you could get a "can't find server" message.  

 

Before you start you need to know there are 63 articles. I respectfully suggest that you NOT start with "Servicing the Gear Box". In addition to a massive headache it will convince you to never remove the gearbox from the engine.  

 

 

I took the time to put all the CPS articles onto our forum. You can find them in alphabetical order here

 

http://www.avidfoxflyers.com/index.php?/topic/2030-california-power-systems-2-stroke-tech-articles-all-in-one-place/

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