Post a pic of your gas door struts

[C5Engineer 1170]

Can one of you guys post a picture of your gas door struts with both the doors open and doors closed. I have some struts sitting here and I need to figure out the best way to mount them to get the geometry right.

[akflyer 1427]

I just kinda guessed at the geometry last week and it worked.  I made quick and dirty mounting tabs out of aluminum. They are a little flimsy so I am going to make new ones out of split tubing with the mount tab welded on like the factory made.

[dholly 718]

Here are pics showing (3) different fuse attach points.

My Avid+ - also shows door tab location

My Mk-IV - rectangular mounting plate just over shoulder

C-Model(?) - a little different setup but same location as MK-IV, also shows baggage floor idea that allows flaperon control tubes to remain connected during wing fold

[dholly 718]

I missed this earlier, it's a C model door tab. 

[C5Engineer 1170]

Thanks.. this is what I'm dealing with right now.. the cupboard hinge pokes me in the shoulder

[C5Engineer 1170]

Hey AKFlyer what is that stuff out on your strut?

[Av8r3400 1178]

Looks like a helmet cam to me.  YOUTUBE, baby!!

[akflyer 1427]

yeppers it is my helmet cam... too damn bad some idiot forgot to charge tha batteries... I got a few minuted of vids, but not much.  I will get more next weekend when I go home.  We have a model flyin about an hour away from the house so I am skipping out on work for 5 days to go play   I am gonna bring the Avid up tere to go sniff out thermals before I fire up the old timers and go for official flights.  It is a S.A.M. contest.... nothing like cheating to win

OUCH, the levers in the neck dont look like much fun at all!  Will be a quick fix for you with struts.

[C5Engineer 1170]

Sweet! Would like to see some footage of that. I drilled out my current mounting points today. I ordered the original hardware from Airdale.. cost me $10. I already have the original struts out of a kit that my dad sold and had stuff left over. This is probably a dumb question but what is the difference between a regular and an SST rivet?

[akflyer 1427]

The SST are a cherry max rivet.. they have a double mandrel so they dont work loose like a round regular pop rivet will.  spend the extra few bucks and get the good ones!  I didnt the first time cause I knew the aluminum brackets I made wouls not last long.. they were more of a test to see if the geometry would work.  Now I will drill the out, make real brackets and put them on right.  Little structural adhesive, few rivets and she will be there from now till the end of time, or end of airframe, whichever comes first

[84KF 4]

A "Cherry" SST rivet is a "blind" rivet...., a structural pop rivet. (Blind rivets are use when there is no access to the "other" side.)

The hole must be exact size as the rivet does not expand or swell when pulled. The length of rivet used must be correct for the thickness of the material...eg..."grip". They are available in "nominal" and "over sized"

A special depth gauge tool is used to determine the proper length

They will be about a $1.00 each unless bought in bulk. Very strong and a FAA approved replacement for small bolts when properly installed.

There is a special way to remove them if necessary.

Anything else is just a plain old hardware store pop rivet to me...., cheap, weak, and non-structural.

An AD Rivet (regular, aluminum) will swell and fill the hole when driven, or bucked. You can use long ones and cut to length with a rivet cutter, or good wire cutters and file the ends square.

[C5Engineer 1170]

Leni can you get me a shot from the back of your plane looking forward where your struts actually go through your tabs? The problem I'm having is the tabs on my strut is a flat piece with a 1/2" hole. There are no threaded studs on them. SOOOO the strut body hits on the door frame WAY before the tab on the strut and the tab on my door frame line up. I'm going to have to come up with a way to offset the strut from the door frame mounting tab about 3/4 of an inch.

Here is what Airdale sent me and an illustration of what I'm talking about. Anyone have any good ideas? This is all factory parts including the struts which came out of a MKIV kit. I'm either being retarded or this set up isn't going to work with out some tweaking.

[akflyer 1427]

I am at work till Wednesday.  I can get a pic then but mine mount differnt with ball mounts.  Is it possible to move the strut lower on the fuse and in on the door frame so it is more perpendicular?  I know the strut mount is only out a couple inches on the door frame.  I will get a buddy to post a pic of his as they are mounted the same way your are I think.

[GLMCMINN 0]

HERE IS MY LIFT STRUT INSTULATION ON MY AVID A.    THE LIFT STRUT BRAND I USED WAS SPRING LIFT.  MODEL # SL-1-40//    THE TOP MOUNTING BRACKET IS 1.5" LONG AND THE BOTTOM BRACKET IS 1" LONG.  FROM THE TOP OF THE DOOR FRAME TO THE TOP BRACKET IS 3.75" TO CENTER.  HOPE THIS HELPS.  SURE MAKES IT NICE NOT HOLDING THE DOOR OPEN TO GET IN OR OUT.  IF YOU NEED MORE PICS LET ME KNOW.   

[C5Engineer 1170]

Thanks alot! That is what I was looking for. That is the same hardware that I am using. Looks like that bottom piece just needs to be angled a bit for the strut body to clear the door frame. Like the color of your bird!

[akflyer 1427]

make sure you have the washers on there too so the strut does not slide up on the bracket.  Bolt, washer, strut, washer, bracket, nut.

[C5Engineer 1170]

I just came in from working on this project. As I was deciding where to mount my brackets it dawned on me it's critical where the door ends up when it's open. I currently have my wings off my plane.  I plan on flying with the doors open every chance I get here in sunny California. I want to be able to just unlatch the door and let it fly into place. Should I put the struts so that the door just touches the wing bottom, fits snug against it, or so that when the strut is fully extended it's clearanced from the wing 1/2" or so? I don't want to worry about beating up my wings with the doors open in flight.... thoughts?

[GLMCMINN 0]

DONT KNOW IF THIS WILL HELP BUT MY DOOR IS 90 DEGREES FROM THE FUS WHEN ITS OPEN..  ITS 1.25" FROM THE BOTTOM OF THE WING. 

GOOD LUCK.............

[C5Engineer 1170]

I put a level on my door before I drilled out the old cabinet hinges I had and they were very close to being level when fully open too. I think I will just go with that and see how they do. Brett at Airdale said they used to just stick a piece of rubber to the lexan so it would contact a wing rib when the door was open to act as a "door stop" Have you flown with your doors open in this configuration? I'm assuming that if the strut was maxed out before the door touched the wing and there was an inch of clearance that the door would not contact the wing inflight. The reason I asked is I heard a rumor that the doors will flutter if they are not contacting the wing in flight.

[GLMCMINN 0]

I HAVENT FLOWN WITH THE DOORS OPEN YET.  BUT I THINK IF YOU USE A STRONG DOOR STRUT IT SHOULD HOLD IT FROM FLUTERING. WHEN MY DOOR IS OPEN I CAN PUSH ON IT AND IT WILL NOT TOUCH MY WING.  GOOD LUCK HOPE IT WORKS OUT.  DONT SEE WHY IT WONT.

[akflyer 1427]

I did a breif flight with mine ipen, and did not notice any flutter.. I did not do any hard slips etc to really test it out as I never really thought about it and it was damn cold outside   I have flown quite a bit in my brothers old KF II withthe doors open, but he did not have struts on them, the air just held them up against the wings.  I have heard of guys letting the door hang there, and as they increase speed on takeoff the doors will slowly move up t othe bottom of the wing and stay there until they land and slow down enough for them to drop.

[C5Engineer 1170]

I got the bracket riveted to the door last night. I put a bolt through it and the strut and while holding the lower bracket firmly against the fuse did a test to check the geometry. My strut I have would not hold the door open. I guess in the 15 years or so they sat in a box they lost some of their strength. Glad I did this test before I riveted the lower brackets on. I ordered two new struts from McMasters. The part #'s are 9416K312 and 9416K84 for the eyelets. They cost less than $12 a piece are supposed to be a pretty much direct bolt on for what originally came in the kits. My local Napa, Kragens, carquest, or regular parts store could not get anything that was fairly close. Napa came close but it was only 25lbs and I didn't think that would be strong enough.

[akflyer 1427]

how many # lift are those struts?  I have a 30# on mine now but an going to go with 40# or 45# cause they loose alot in the cold

[C5Engineer 1170]

The ones I had were 30 but I could compress them with the palm of my hand pretty easily so I think they lost some strength. They were out of an old kit my Dad bought and sold. What is this "cold" you speak of....California is good for a few things..weather being one of them.

[GLMCMINN 0]

Here u go c5e, got some pics of here on friday.  This if flight #6 and still having overheating issues.    replumbed it saturday night with all 1" hose.  Now there is no copper 90's or 45's in the system.  This should do the trick.