Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

my wing mod: hybrid speed stol

28 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

hello, i'd like to share the mod i made with my wing (please don't think i'm fool ;) and forgive my bad english language)

Ok.. My kit came complete but unfinished with short speed wings well assembled. I' d prefer stol but but we do with what and i didn't want extend long speed cause it is not very smart in my eyes, mostly with washout and short flap on it, and i alway thought that the flaps on speed are way to low from the trailing edge because there position is defined by the fuse and no aérodynamic purpose.

So i decided to go with the upper line of the stol airfoil as the root rib (this is the upper surface and thickness which make the lift) and a half extension of one rib. In that mod i didn't touch the general assembly so i gained time and money and will have the stol airfoil exept the dragging under camber: magically, with comparison and research, i near match the kitfox airfoil.

Here we go !

 

First i remouved tail ribs and caps trick with hot gun :

a.thumb.jpg.afae8107f65261c836e9ac123833

2- I made a wood piece to match the stol airfoil and glutted with gussets 

b.thumb.jpg.b05b458c13ef660d8519c4488cf9

c.thumb.jpg.6888bff7230d00e53e2d2a1fa6bc

 

3- I lowered the trailing edge as the stol the same way (on pic you can see the diff between speed and stol, and the reason why the flaps are so low for the speed)

d.thumb.jpg.7e15d0bbb2e20d9047ac2669cd63

4 i put new ribtails for the tank i wanted to keep

e.thumb.jpg.0022e3f7986f2e44f98c480c7732

f.thumb.jpg.bc6181b1993c4591400bc450d738g.thumb.jpg.8fa0b519441580a69dbead8cb6a1h.thumb.jpg.56b73736d2ec1bc1ebccf0051d8f

 

5- I made false ribs on the tank to match the  stol airfoil (the speed tank is going from stol at the root to flat speed) in the pics, there is not yet fiber on them

i.thumb.jpg.6bb8e009b84dbb6c8f30a380d01c

 

6- i made one section extension and extended a bit flap with rounded foam tip( lucky, there was the flap spar continuing at the edge for about 15 cm)

j.thumb.jpg.9a23d3141ac9e5c3047363762c8ak.thumb.jpg.7213ea1431fd1d8ea026095797b6

 

and after common building, the new wings were finished

l.thumb.jpg.2d5cde37e55a776aaf2532dcafe2m.thumb.jpg.fe675bdc07201dc14d257b363380n.thumb.jpg.2d073f35a481e03037cd8d8b2462o.thumb.jpg.be1c2d5f5a5b0511b07231abe051

 

That's it :)

 

 

Edited by efil 01
5 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Thank you for documenting this process!! Wing mods is a topic that comes up frequently but it seems all we do is talk about it. Excellent post and pictures! Please continue to keep us updated on the rest of your build!!

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

 

looks nice good job

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

It looks like you do very high quality work.

It will be interesting to see how this plane handles.  The flapperons were originally designed in the same theory as the Junkers style controls, Below and behind the wing to put them in the high pressure air to improve their performance. 

By placing them closer to the trailing edge of the wing, this may (or may not) impart some interesting handling behaviors. 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

It looks like you do very high quality work.

It will be interesting to see how this plane handles.  The flapperons were originally designed in the same theory as the Junkers style controls, Below and behind the wing to put them in the high pressure air to improve their performance. 

By placing them closer to the trailing edge of the wing, this may (or may not) impart some interesting handling behaviors. 

thanks

 For the flaps, i respected the position of the classic stol wing. i just discovered that the plane was designed with stol wing, and the plates of the fuselage force the flaps  to be lower from trailing edge with the speed airfoil

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Thank you for documenting this process!! Wing mods is a topic that comes up frequently but it seems all we do is talk about it. Excellent post and pictures! Please continue to keep us updated on the rest of your build!!

thanks a lot, my plane now is painted 

IMG_1195.thumb.JPG.481567b5a18523f1fdd42

 

commands are done, now i'm doing firewall, as you can see i've got a spécial controller to valid the job ;)

IMG_1838.thumb.JPG.db53e07da85576cb9010b

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Now that is high quality work!

 

I don't know anyone who has done a full "Cat Scan" on their plane during the build process!

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Looking great, thanks for sharing! And what an interesting airfoil modification, I'm very curious how it performs. Just so folks can better visualize, I am attaching some pics of the different ribs 'stacked' side-by-side (found 'em Jim :)).

In order starting with the 'blue' rib...

  • Avid Butt Rib
  • Avid Transitional Root Rib (top airfoil same as Avid HH/STOL rib, lower airfoil same as Avid Speed rib)
  • Avid Speed Rib
  • Kitfox 4-7 Rib
  • Kitfox 1-3 Butt Rib

I also have added pics of Avid HH/STOL Rib (blue) next to Kitfox 1-3 Rib (top airfoil same, slightly more under camber on the Avid rib, Rear spar location hole lower in the web on the KF rib) side-by-side.

IMG_0404.JPG

IMG_0405.JPG

IMG_0406.JPG

IMG_0407.JPG

IMG_0408.JPG

IMG_0409.JPG

IMG_0410.JPG

IMG_0411.JPG

CIMG4988.JPG

CIMG4989.JPG

CIMG4990.JPG

CIMG4991.JPG

CIMG4993.JPG

CIMG4994.JPG

CIMG4997.JPG

CIMG4999.JPG

CIMG5003.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

One more question about the ribs Doug,  Could you put the Kitfox 1-3 rib next to the Kitfox 4 rib.  I'm trying to see if a Kitfox 4 tank can be used in a Kitfox 1-3.  I think there is space between the fabric and the bottom of the fabric on a 4, so maybe the undercamber on earlier models would still have the tank 'inside' the rib profile.  Jim Chuk

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

great collection Doug! it would be great to draw them on a paper with different colors with the same point at leading and trailing edge, to see the diff and have them as an archive

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

great collection Doug! it would be great to draw them on a paper with different colors with the same point at leading and trailing edge, to see the diff and have them as an archive

Some time ago, I put the drawings of the Kitfox 5 and Kitfox 1 ribs overlaying each other, along with some "modification lines" that I used to convert my undercambered wing to a modified late model rib, and showed leading edge extension I had put on mine to balance the Subaru engine.   You can find this in "Files and Forms", and we also posted the dimensions for the new Riblett-designed Kitfox ribs in another post, along with his analysis of the bubble that forms under the undercamber at about 90 mph causing drag, and a letter from someone who had put VGs on the Underside of his leading edge and gained about 10 mph cruise.

EDMO

Edited by EDMO

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

One more question about the ribs Doug,  Could you put the Kitfox 1-3 rib next to the Kitfox 4 rib.  I'm trying to see if a Kitfox 4 tank can be used in a Kitfox 1-3.  I think there is space between the fabric and the bottom of the fabric on a 4, so maybe the undercamber on earlier models would still have the tank 'inside' the rib profile.  Jim Chuk

Jim,

Files and Forms - Kitfox Ribs - august 2013 - on page 2 - Lines drawn in 3 colors, with yardstick so you can enlarge to size.

I think I may have used Kitfox 2 and 4 ribs, but said in last post 1 and 5 ribs - no matter, it would be the same.

EDMO

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Don't want to hijack this one but Doug what are those wings you have there with the Aluminum Ribs? Are you scratch building Kitfox-Avid  with Aluminum Ribs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Don't want to hijack this one but Doug what are those wings you have there with the Aluminum Ribs? Are you scratch building Kitfox-Avid  with Aluminum Ribs?

We hijack threads all the time - Those are probably for his Aeroturk - cant remember name!

There is a guy in Missouri building an ultralight and making aluminum Kitfox ribs at home for it - He don't talk since he got a Kitfox 5 to fly.

EdmO

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

The aluminum ribs (in the assembled wing) are from his Aerotrek rebuild project.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

Jim - the KF1-3 rib is next to the KF 4 rib in the first set of pics. Sorry, but I don't think you're going to get a KF4 tank in a KF1-3 wing. The other way around maybe, but not the way you want.

Yessir, Aeropro... Aerotrek... Aeroturk... Aerotoad... Aeroturd, take your pick!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Jim,

     I agree with Doug - If you were going to put KF4 tanks in BOTH undercambered wings, the bottom bulge probably wouldn't matter, but you don't want the wings to be different.

     I haven't checked on the KF123 long rib yet - maybe Doug has one he would sell?

EdMO

Edited by EDMO

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

the panel begins to grow, basic instruments, cute digitals avid engine instruments 

12113359_1642018696057799_82818662077429

 

pls if someone have : i need pics of turtle deck, mostly how it fits near rear spar and center line where is jonction between the 2 parts

thx! :BC:

Manu.

Edited by efil 01
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

I have one of those tachs that I found in my Barnfind. I had no idea they made other instruments as well. Any idea what year your Kit came from the factory? I would get you a 0-100mph AS indicator. Your normal flying window will be about 60-80. The scale is way too big on that one...just my two cents.

Edited by C5Engineer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

my kit is C model 691 from 1989/90 , yeah about scale, we'll see if i need change

EDIT: btw, the official mark4 numbers give 135 vne for the stol, if it's accurate, i certainly won't change it

Edited by efil 01
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

here is what i did with my turtle deck, no hinge

 

turtle deck 001.JPG

turtle deck 002.JPG

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

thx!! so you decided to not split it in two pieces? how is it hard to instal?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

I've been following the discussion on the placement of the flaperons on your wings and have a question regarding the counter balance weights required on them.  With the flaperon to wing clearance reduced, will you have adequate clearance to allow full travel of the flaperon before the weight hits the bottom of the wing.  On my heavy hauler wings the weight comes very close to the bottom of the wing, or even touches it at the extreme limits of travel.  Are you using another method of providing counter-balance?

Jackak

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

as i've not reveted them yet, i ll be able to find a solution if they touch the under wing :BC: that's a great input - i'm not afraid about that,  they are made with plumb , may be you can give them angle with a big hammer

Manu

edit: the flaps  are shorter than classic stol, so they are lighter, so counter weights are shorter 

Edited by efil 01

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted

super easy to install just lay it on and turn the camlocks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0