Teenie Two prep for a 2100 nautical mile cross country

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Posted

I figured rather than adding the work to my questions about where to stop and what to do on my journey across the country in the smallest plane I've ever seen, I'd better start another journal or thread for it. 

Earlier this week I was able to finish the full airframe inspection and I believe the plane is ready to go. The issue is that I have space for "stuff" that I want to take but it's all behind the seat and really throws the W&B back to a point I don't like it. According to my calculations with only 25 pounds of baggage I'm behind the aft CG limit. The strange thing is that I have a hard time believing this because it flies so well with some weight back there. The big issue is really that I can't figure out where the W&B is when I'm in the plane and I'm guessing at a station for where I sit. The seat is fixed, if you want to call it a seat. I really do just sit down inside the wing center section. If I move the pilot position just 2" forward it makes a HUGE difference. 

Anyway, long story short I decided to build a cargo pod. I have plastic wing tips from my Sonerai project that are perfectly smooth and basically make a much better female mold for fiberglass than I could make unless given a lot of time and materials. This morning I cleaned them up, waxed and them laid out some fairly nice fiberglass pieces. I plan to take the two tips, add a small center section and fiberglass them together to make what will look somewhat like a drop tank. Since I'm only making one I will hang it up under the cockpit. It has the big advantage that I can then put all my storage in front of the wing and really help my CG limits. I've even toyed with the idea of making the rear part of it detach and work as an extra fuel tank. Thus really making it a drop tank, but that I hope never drops. I have a really cool idea of how to attach the pod so that I can quick pin it and it won't be able to go anywhere. It will only leave a small attachment under the belly of the plane that won't create much if any drag when the pod is detached. The added bonus is that I will then be able to just grab the pod and take it with me like luggage. 

After laying up the sides of the cargo pod I decided I needed to change out my stick grip. I've been using a bicycle grip for the 7 years I've owned the plane. Like most bicycle grips it has become kind of sticky and jelly like. Last night I glued up two small pieces of Mahogany I had in the garage so I grabbed it today and started carving. 

I've always liked the looks and feel of a fighter type grip but couldn't justify paying the kind of money they want for them from Aircraft Spruce or other places. Plus me being the woodworker that I am the wood part came naturally. 

Two hours after starting I have a beautiful working grip that will likely last for years to come! All I have to do is finish another coat or two of floor finish on it and then drill and set the push to talk switch up in it. I'l likely have it installed tomorrow evening if all goes well. Since I built it to fit me it sure feels nice! 

I'll post pictures of both of these projects tomorrow when I have a chance to get them in the light.

If this trip happens I will create a travel log of sorts so you all can follow along. Just not sure where to post it up quite yet. 

Kenneth
 

 

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Posted

As far as determining a pilot's CG location/station for weight and balance purposes, I have read that you measure to the pilot's belly button and you are pretty close.  Don't know for sure this is true, but it's what I've read and it seems logical.  Jim Chuk

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Posted

This is what I've read as well Jim. But after a lot of reading on the subject that seems like it's more in an upright position. My legs are straight forward and I have to think that it will put the human CG forward quite a bit with legs stretched out forward instead of hanging down at a near 90 degree angle. 

To test this theory out I balance on a Yoga ball. That's what I've used for a desk chair for two years anyway. The more I stick my legs forward the farther back I have to lean in order to keep the balance. With my legs straight out I have to lean back about 6 inches. I guess my CG is still near my belly button but since I can't lean back any more than the back of the seat in the plane it still makes me think when I'm in that position it has to be at least two inches in front of my navel. That makes a HUGE difference in my CG figures on the plane. 

I may have to take the plane off the trailer and actually weigh it with me in it to determine where I really sit for CG calculations. That's of course the best way to do it. I just can't get the plane off the trailer right now do to another project in the way.

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Posted (edited)

If you had a couple of fairly accurate bathroom scales and a plank you might be able to get an idea of where your CG is.  Sit on the plank like you would in the plane, pick a datum point, have some one read the scales, and then do the math.  Might work ;-)  Maybe have to put the scales up on blocks or something to get your legs below your seat, but should be doable I would think.  Jim Chuk

PS  In my post, I was referring to determining a station and weight for the pilot if he is not able to do it in the plane, and then calculating the flying aircrafts CG using math. 

Edited by 1avidflyer

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Posted

If you had a couple of fairly accurate bathroom scales and a plank you might be able to get an idea of where your CG is.  Sit on the plank like you would in the plane, pick a datum point, have some one read the scales, and then do the math.  Might work ;-)  Maybe have to put the scales up on blocks or something to get your legs below your seat, but should be doable I would think.  Jim Chuk

Don't forget to raise the tail and level the plane.    EDMO

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Posted

If you had a couple of fairly accurate bathroom scales and a plank you might be able to get an idea of where your CG is.  Sit on the plank like you would in the plane, pick a datum point, have some one read the scales, and then do the math.  Might work ;-)  Maybe have to put the scales up on blocks or something to get your legs below your seat, but should be doable I would think.  Jim Chuk

PS  In my post, I was referring to determining a station and weight for the pilot if he is not able to do it in the plane, and then calculating the flying aircrafts CG using math. 

Like I said, my feet and legs literally are straight forward in this plane. I was thinking of doing this earlier today too. Good idea. 

If you had a couple of fairly accurate bathroom scales and a plank you might be able to get an idea of where your CG is.  Sit on the plank like you would in the plane, pick a datum point, have some one read the scales, and then do the math.  Might work ;-)  Maybe have to put the scales up on blocks or something to get your legs below your seat, but should be doable I would think.  Jim Chuk

Don't forget to raise the tail and level the plane.    EDMO

Raise the tail Ed? It's a trike....

It does actually sit in a level position to start with. I know what you mean, but had to give you a hard time.

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Posted (edited)

If you had a couple of fairly accurate bathroom scales and a plank you might be able to get an idea of where your CG is.  Sit on the plank like you would in the plane, pick a datum point, have some one read the scales, and then do the math.  Might work ;-)  Maybe have to put the scales up on blocks or something to get your legs below your seat, but should be doable I would think.  Jim Chuk

PS  In my post, I was referring to determining a station and weight for the pilot if he is not able to do it in the plane, and then calculating the flying aircrafts CG using math. 

Like I said, my feet and legs literally are straight forward in this plane. I was thinking of doing this earlier today too. Good idea. 

If you had a couple of fairly accurate bathroom scales and a plank you might be able to get an idea of where your CG is.  Sit on the plank like you would in the plane, pick a datum point, have some one read the scales, and then do the math.  Might work ;-)  Maybe have to put the scales up on blocks or something to get your legs below your seat, but should be doable I would think.  Jim Chuk

Don't forget to raise the tail and level the plane.    EDMO

Raise the tail Ed? It's a trike....

It does actually sit in a level position to start with. I know what you mean, but had to give you a hard time.

OMG!  That admission can destroy your "real pilot" image on here!  :lol: Yes, you need to level it after it is loaded with your butt in it and then check CG.  You may need a helper and a jack for that in addition to reading the scales.   EDMO

Edited by EDMO
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Posted

I was able to finish the basic pod today. It didn't turn out as clean as I would have liked but rather than spend another week on it I decided to just get it done. Tomorrow I can work on hangers that will attach to the bottom of the fuselage and top of the pod. It will allow me to quick disconnect it on the ground to load it and grab things out of it. I may also build another one at some point but for now this one just needs some sanding and paint, or at least some cheap grey primer to make it look like an old drop tank. 

I also got the new grip installed today. It took me almost as long to get the push to talk switch set into it as it did to make the darn thing. It's still a much nicer grip than the bicycle one I had. 

Hopefully tomorrow I'll have a couple more pictures of the pod. I really like the shape of it and it's actually just a small wing....maybe added lift? ;)

IMG_2873 (Medium).JPG

IMG_2878 (Medium).JPG

IMG_2880 (Medium).JPG

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Posted

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

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Posted

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

One will do for me please ::)

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Posted

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

One will do for me please ::)

What hand do you guys want? I can do either one. What are you looking to spend? I didn't really think about making them for sale, but I don't see why not. Also I need to know center diameter for your stick. Mine is 3/4" hole for the tubing on the plane. Can't remember what the Avid was for sure. 

I will be making more for sure. My Sonerai Project needs a couple as well. After a quick search for them on Aircraft Spruce the ones like this start at $122 and there are several for over $250!! Holy cow, now I remember why I make my own things! 

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Posted

Yesterday I got the hard mounts built and on the airplane for the cargo pod. I also figured out how easily I an add a "pumpkin drop" sling to this setup, making it truly a drop mechanism. One quick pull of a string and it would release whatever I have hung under it in the sling.

Back to the work today. I worked most of the day on finish work on the cargo pod and cleaning up the canopy. To do this I added a sloped back to it, before it was just flat. This is something I've been wanting to do for the past several years. For one, I trailer the plane quite often and it sits backwards on the trailer. Before this work it had a huge flat area on the back (front while towing) of the canopy. Now it should be much cleaner for both flying and towing. I'm also hoping that getting rid of this low pressure drag area will increase the cruise speed just a tiny bit and also increase the rudder effectiveness. It wasn't that I need more rudder but I have always wondered if it was being blanked out a little from the flat area only a few feet in front of it. 

I'm looking for an older picture of the profile of the canopy before the work but if you notice where the upright support is in the picture you can imagine that it just stopped flat there. I think the new addition to the canopy really makes it look much more finished. I always though it looked like I just gave up when building it the first time. If I could get 4130 locally I would have just rebuilt the entire thing. This is the prototype I built over five years ago and it's still going. 

DSC07509 (Medium).JPG

DSC07502 (Medium).JPG

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Posted

That looks like a huge improvement in airflow - nice going!  EDMO

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Posted

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

 

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

One will do for me please ::)

What hand do you guys want? I can do either one. What are you looking to spend? I didn't really think about making them for sale, but I don't see why not. Also I need to know center diameter for your stick. Mine is 3/4" hole for the tubing on the plane. Can't remember what the Avid was for sure. 

I will be making more for sure. My Sonerai Project needs a couple as well. After a quick search for them on Aircraft Spruce the ones like this start at $122 and there are several for over $250!! Holy cow, now I remember why I make my own things! 

Well one way to figure it out, If Aircraft Spruce is starting at $122 I would say they are only paying $61 that would be a nice starting point, Maybe that could be a bare wood un finished price.

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Posted

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

 

I'll take (2) of those grips please. :)

One will do for me please ::)

What hand do you guys want? I can do either one. What are you looking to spend? I didn't really think about making them for sale, but I don't see why not. Also I need to know center diameter for your stick. Mine is 3/4" hole for the tubing on the plane. Can't remember what the Avid was for sure. 

I will be making more for sure. My Sonerai Project needs a couple as well. After a quick search for them on Aircraft Spruce the ones like this start at $122 and there are several for over $250!! Holy cow, now I remember why I make my own things! 

Well one way to figure it out, If Aircraft Spruce is starting at $122 I would say they are only paying $61 that would be a nice starting point, Maybe that could be a bare wood un finished price.

That's a good Point. I'll do you one better. If anyone wants one, let me know which hand you want. I'll build them and send them out for $60 each, that includes shipping. I will have it finished in a good polyurethane floor finish. You can drill out for your PTT if you chose or send it to me and for another $10 I'll fit it in the grip. It's time consuming to install them and make them work well for their location. 

 

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Posted

Back to work on the pod this morning. I'm not used to this humidity. Nothing I do seems to ever dry out, including spray paint! I finished the pod and the fiberglass work needed to make it totally smooth didn't appeal to me (at least not for now) so I gave it a quick (okay time consuming really), paint job. I just have to let it sit out in the heat and cure the paint for a couple days now...no idea why it's taking to long to dry, it's new paint! 

What do you all think? The paint scheme is fitting since this whole idea of flying 2100NM miles across the country in an airplane that only weighs 370 pound, may or may not be crazy. I figured the paint needed to mirror that idea. 

Cargo pod.jpg

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Posted

Looks like the hip of a Zebra with swollen ankles....:)

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Posted (edited)

I was hoping for "Safety Orange", so you can find it when it blows off!  Maybe you should tape a note inside of it saying, "Return to Lostman at _______."  ?  :lol:  EDMO

Edited by EDMO
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Posted (edited)

Looks like the hip of a Zebra with swollen ankles....:)

Lostman sir:  Just in case you may have missed the humor in my extraordinarily well developed sardonic comment please accept my apology.  I admire a man of your pluck and courage.  Some might quail at such a long flight in so tiny a craft but I think it's a great undertaking.  My comments about wild animal parts notwithstanding the cargo pod is a terrific addition and I'm sure will re-pay handsomely the time and funds you've devoted to it's development and installation.  Some wag might observe that a bird such as yours, though surely safe and comfortable for a flight of perhaps a mile, would hardly be adequate or even sane for a journey of 2100 of same.  Au Contraire Mes Amis!  For every journey of 2100 miles begins with a single step etc. etc.  So lots of photos and a travel log are of course requested.  An acquaintance of mine who lives in the wilds and flies off his driveway uses a 9 gallon reinforced rubber bladder to carry additional fuel for his S7S.  I very much doubt that you would find room for a like container filled in the Teeny Two but something similar may perhaps be jammed somewhere empty in the event that you should find yourself afoot and within walking distance of the odd fuel emporium.  

I hope they're not paying this fellow by the pound......  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjpKgFgoUlQ

Ahhh!  Much better, I want one.  

Edited by Emory Bored
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Posted

Here's another one.  A roll even!!

 

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Posted

I was hoping for "Safety Orange", so you can find it when it blows off!  Maybe you should tape a note inside of it saying, "Return to Lostman at _______."  ?  :lol:  EDMO

Ed, I did think about safety yellow actually. Since I already have a can of it and it basically matches the stripes on the plane. I just really hope that it doesn't come loose. Now you have me worrying about it! I figured that 12 1/8" stainless steel rivets should of course hold the pod on securely. Maybe a safety strap is in order though...

Looks like the hip of a Zebra with swollen ankles....:)

Lostman sir:  Just in case you may have missed the humor in my extraordinarily well developed sardonic comment please accept my apology.  I admire a man of your pluck and courage.  Some might quail at such a long flight in so tiny a craft but I think it's a great undertaking.  My comments about wild animal parts notwithstanding the cargo pod is a terrific addition and I'm sure will re-pay handsomely the time and funds you've devoted to it's development and installation.  Some wag might observe that a bird such as yours, though surely safe and comfortable for a flight of perhaps a mile, would hardly be adequate or even sane for a journey of 2100 of same.  Au Contraire Mes Amis!  For every journey of 2100 miles begins with a single step etc. etc.  So lots of photos and a travel log are of course requested.  An acquaintance of mine who lives in the wilds and flies off his driveway uses a 9 gallon reinforced rubber bladder to carry additional fuel for his S7S.  I very much doubt that you would find room for a like container filled in the Teeny Two but something similar may perhaps be jammed somewhere empty in the event that you should find yourself afoot and within walking distance of the odd fuel emporium.  

I hope they're not paying this fellow by the pound......  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NjpKgFgoUlQ

Ahhh!  Much better, I want one.  

I do appreciate the humor and comments. I will have to post up this "most epic adventure" (read in the style of Bill and Ted). I doubt I'll have a lot of internet during this trip as I plan to camp with the plane when possible. I will of course be taking lots of photos and can always upload the log of the trip after I get somewhere civilized again.

Here is the finalized version of the Zebra pod. I was able to cannibalize the straps and buckles from an old camping chair. Everything else I made. Since I already had all the pieces this actually didn't cost me a penny out of pocket. It's nice to have a well stocked garage/work shop. I am almost out of fiberglass resin though. In fact all the work I've done to the plane this year hasn't cost me anything. The one thing I'll have to go buy is car door edge molding for the new canopy that overhangs the turtledeck. I don't want it to run into the aluminum.  

IMG_2884.JPG

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Posted (edited)

Kenneth,   My post was to get you to take a second-look at your mounting, which never hurts - and some well-meaning humor!  I am looking forward to the reports of your trip.  What is your time and speed for a flight before a fuel stop?

Good Flying, 

P.S.  Maybe with lots of therapy you will be able to walk again!  Ha!  EDMO

Edited by EDMO

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Posted

If I had the time, I would love to cowboy up and do it with you. When its all over you will be glad you went.

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Kenneth,   My post was to get you to take a second-look at your mounting, which never hurts - and some well-meaning humor!  I am looking forward to the reports of your trip.  What is your time and speed for a flight before a fuel stop?

Good Flying, 

P.S.  Maybe with lots of therapy you will be able to walk again!  Ha!  EDMO

I took a good hard think about them before I built them. Since they are built of 4130 they are solid. It was actually the rivets that go through the fiberglass that your comment made me think of. I actually went back and drilled them all out, put better aluminum backers behind them so it sandwiches the fiberglass and installed new rivets. I'd be willing to bet I can hang on my cargo pod and it won't move now. I can't really put more than about 20-25 pounds in it anyway. 

I can fly for about 3 hours and still have over 35 minutes of fuel. My butt and bladder say I can fly for about two hours before I need to stretch. I've never done more than about 1:35 at on time before so this whole adventure is pretty crazy to say the least. Since I cruise at 105 MPH true I really should be able to knock out 600 miles a day if I put in two flights, one in the morning and then one in the evening. Or even break it into three or four short flights. It's not about getting there quickly this trip, it's about the journey. Probably the first time I've ever planned to go cross country just to enjoy the trip instead of getting somewhere at a specified time. Strange thought after almost 3,900 hours of flight time in my log book that I've never just done it to do it. It was always about getting there. I suppose one gets wiser with age, or in my case maybe more senile to even attempt such a thing as this!

If I had the time, I would love to cowboy up and do it with you. When its all over you will be glad you went.

You're more than welcome to join for just an hour or two if you have the time. I know you're not really close to the route though. In fact anyone is more than welcome to join me for any part of the journey. 

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Posted

I feel like I've taken one step forward and five steps back today. I spent three hours more going over the airplane as I put it together after signing a tie down agreement at a local private field. After getting it together the thermals had kicked up to a point that I saw dozens of turkey vultures circling over head. Not a good sign to do test flying. I packed it in and came home.

This morning in an attempt to beat the thermals into the sky I went out to the airport rather early (at least for me). Only to find the wind was gusting over 20. Instead of flying I changed one tire that needed to be replaced (yeah, nose gear), made an adjustment on my steering rod so when the rudder bar is centered it tracks fairly straight. I also put my climb prop back on and test ran the engine up to temp again. After that I adjusted the carbs for sea level and ran it around the grass for a few minutes. I still need to adjust the nose steering linkage a touch but it's okay for now. 

Then got too hot and decided to call it quits at noon.

After all of this and spending three hours last night weighing everything I planned to take I've come to the realization I'm nuts. I don't think this flight is going to happen since I can't possibly carry even the bare essentials for a week without being quite a bit over gross. By quite a bit I mean 60 pounds. That may not seem like a lot but when the gross on the data plate is 590 and I figure I'll be 650 with just the essentials and fuel....the percentage isn't good. It still means that this little plane would be good for just over 5 G's and I wouldn't ever get close to that, but I also know that means my glide rate will suffer in the event that something were to happen to the engine. I would be flying over some very inhospitable parts of the country as well. 

I don't know for sure but I broke down and purchased a non-stop ticket from here to Utah for the day I need to be there last night. I still have until 10 PM to cancel it with no penalty but since I couldn't test fly the plane today with the cargo pod empty I'm a bit gun shy. Sure I could cancel my ticket, hope the weather holds good next Wednesday or then go ahead and buy another one. There is not way I'll find another non-stop for the price though.

It's strange to me that what will take me close to 6 days of flying 5 to 6 hours a day, can be made in 4 hours in a modern jetliner....dang decisions! 

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