Finally starting new hangar!

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Posted

Mark,  you probably know this, but getting the first piece of roof sheeting installed will be the worst. After that, you have something to stand on.  If I was doing it, I would put a platform you can stand on, on the forklift and position it outside so you can get to the center top of the roof and be able to place the top of the sheet in position.  A guy on a ladder down at the low end of the wall can work that end of the sheet.  Use a pair of vice grips clamped on each end with a rope tied to the vice grips to pull the sheet up to you.    Once that sheet is in place, you can walk on that sheet to set the rest of them fairly easy.  29 gauge sheeting will weigh about 50 lbs. for 25' long piece.  About 75 lbs for 26 gauge.  So you aren't dealing with much weight.  As long as it isn't real windy.... Wish I was closer, I would come and give you a hand.  I'm getting bored down here with nothing to do.   JImChuk

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Posted

Bi Fold door or one big hydraulic one?

One piece hydraulic, but a little different than the typical hydroswing that swings straight out.  www.hpdoors.com  It puts no load on the building going up or down, so the only load transferred to the building is wind load.  Made getting that big an opening much simpler/cheaper.

Mark

 

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Posted

Mark,  you probably know this, but getting the first piece of roof sheeting installed will be the worst. After that, you have something to stand on.  If I was doing it, I would put a platform you can stand on, on the forklift and position it outside so you can get to the center top of the roof and be able to place the top of the sheet in position.  A guy on a ladder down at the low end of the wall can work that end of the sheet.  Use a pair of vice grips clamped on each end with a rope tied to the vice grips to pull the sheet up to you.    Once that sheet is in place, you can walk on that sheet to set the rest of them fairly easy.  29 gauge sheeting will weigh about 50 lbs. for 25' long piece.  About 75 lbs for 26 gauge.  So you aren't dealing with much weight.  As long as it isn't real windy.... Wish I was closer, I would come and give you a hand.  I'm getting bored down here with nothing to do.   JImChuk

Yes, the first piece will be the worst.  I actually think the first 2 pieces on each side will be the worst - 3 feet isn't a lot of room to walk on when the first pieces are set.  At least with a 1/12 pitch roof, walking won't be that big of a challenge.  I'm planning to rent the 45' man lift again as well as the forklift I have rented.  I don't do ladders! :wacko:  For the first pieces, I plan to lift them up with the forklift, on the platform, with one guy on the platform and one guy in the lift.  They should be able to get the first piece on each side set and secured that way, and probably the second piece also.  After that, I can lift the pieces up with the forklift, and they/we should be able to carry them to the next row as we go along.  If it wasn't for the insulation, the roof could probably done in 1 or 2 days, but stopping every 2 pieces to put another roll of insulation up takes a lot of time.

I wish you were closer too!  An experienced guy supervising could probably make it go a lot faster/safer.  I'm happy with how it has gone so far, but it is definitely been slower since I've been learning as I go.  Fortunately I hired the right concrete guy.  I haven't had to shim, or use a come along to straighten anything, it was dead straight and plumb when we put the steel up on the bolts.

Mark

 

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Posted

Mark,  If you have a man lift on the bottom end, that will make it easier, and safer as well.  Not sure how your insulation will work out, but if you were able to start with a 4' piece, it would make putting the next piece of insulation down much easier.  Then working off the last sheet of roof sheeting, you will only be reaching out 1' for the next insulation joint when you lay that down.   If you start with a 6' wide piece of insulation, you will put one sheet of tin down, and then have to lay the next roll of insulation down before you can lay anymore roof sheeting.   Then you are reaching out 3' to make the next insulation joint.  Not near as safe.... Not sure if my explanation makes sense, it did to me :-)  You are a 6 hr drive from me.  Bummer.  JIm

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Posted

Bi Fold door or one big hydraulic one?

One piece hydraulic, but a little different than the typical hydroswing that swings straight out.  www.hpdoors.com  It puts no load on the building going up or down, so the only load transferred to the building is wind load.  Made getting that big an opening much simpler/cheaper.

Mark

 

I saw these at McBean and Stick and Rudder hangers.  These are awesome doors!!  If I ever build another hangar...

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Posted

Mark,  If you have a man lift on the bottom end, that will make it easier, and safer as well.  Not sure how your insulation will work out, but if you were able to start with a 4' piece, it would make putting the next piece of insulation down much easier.  Then working off the last sheet of roof sheeting, you will only be reaching out 1' for the next insulation joint when you lay that down.   If you start with a 6' wide piece of insulation, you will put one sheet of tin down, and then have to lay the next roll of insulation down before you can lay anymore roof sheeting.   Then you are reaching out 3' to make the next insulation joint.  Not near as safe.... Not sure if my explanation makes sense, it did to me :-)  You are a 6 hr drive from me.  Bummer.  JIm

Jim, makes perfect sense, and the insulation came that way.  The 'starter' roll is 4 feet wide.  The next 7 rolls are 6 feet wide, then the 'finish' roll is also 4 feet wide.  The walls were the same.  Didn't really make that much difference on the walls, but I can see it making a huge difference on the roof.  The insulation is one piece, eave to eave.  To get it up, I'm planning to roll it up like a biblical scroll, then carry it to the center were it goes.  I have 4 30' long, 2" wide ratchet straps, and I'll put 2 on each side from the peak to the eave so the insulation has something to roll on, and then let both sides roll down at the same time.   I can use my scissor lift underneath to get the straps out before we put the roofing on.

I'll be glad when this is done.  I lie awake at night trying to figure out how to accomplish some of the things that need to be done.  But then I'll start putting my Avid back together, and I'll lie awake thinking about how to do some of that :rolleyes:

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Posted (edited)

Now you both have me staying awake wondering how the insulation is held up or attached to the metal roofing.  The only insulation I have ever put up was stapled to 2x4s or 2x6s.  Building plane is easy, just put rib A on spars B & C.  ;<)  EDMO

Edited by EDMO

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Posted

Now you both have me staying awake wondering how the insulation is held up or attached to the metal roofing.  The only insulation I have ever put up was stapled to 2x4s or 2x6s.  Building plane is easy, just put rib A on spars B & C.  ;<)  EDMO

Ed, the insulation is sandwiched between the sheeting/roofing and the metal frame.  If you look at the pictures, you should be able to see it.  One advantage to using this instead of spray foaming it, it separates the metal skin from the internal frame with a (very) compressed layer of fiberglass where the skin is attached to the girts/purlins.  Should minimize heat transfer into the building.

Putting it up on the walls, we had to use very sticky double sided tape at the top and bottom to hold it in place while we got the siding on.  We do the same thing on the roof, but that is to keep it pulled tight.

Mark

 

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Posted (edited)

those doors are very cool. I have never seen them before

 

Edited by TJay

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Posted

those doors are very cool. I have never seen them before

 

I hope it works as well as the demo does.  I saw them at Reno Air races a couple of years ago, and at Oshkosh.  After I get it up and working, I'll do a video and post the link here.

Mark

 

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Posted (edited)

Now you both have me staying awake wondering how the insulation is held up or attached to the metal roofing.  The only insulation I have ever put up was stapled to 2x4s or 2x6s.  Building plane is easy, just put rib A on spars B & C.  ;<)  EDMO

Ed, the insulation is sandwiched between the sheeting/roofing and the metal frame.  If you look at the pictures, you should be able to see it.  One advantage to using this instead of spray foaming it, it separates the metal skin from the internal frame with a (very) compressed layer of fiberglass where the skin is attached to the girts/purlins.  Should minimize heat transfer into the building.

Putting it up on the walls, we had to use very sticky double sided tape at the top and bottom to hold it in place while we got the siding on.  We do the same thing on the roof, but that is to keep it pulled tight.

Mark

 

Thanks Mark.  That is luxury!  I've parked my birds in open shelters, wooden hangers, and uninsulated metal hangers - everything was too dirty, too hot, or too cold, sometimes too sweaty, wet and windy!  Now the City will only let me build a wood frame "Garage" that is a foundation percentage of the size of my house, (16' wide x 32' long) which means folding wings are mandatory, but I made the walls 13 feet tall with 12' x 12' bi-fold hinged doors with 6" insulation in them and have 6" stud walls with 6" FG insulation, and 10" FG insulation above ceiling in attic floor, all finished with drywall and painted, with electric heat - AC not connected yet, but it is the nicest one I have ever owned.  I can also park truck with overhead camper or a small motorhome in it.  I now have two fuselages hanging from the ceiling and another on the floor, two sets of wings on the wall and three sets of tailfeathers hanging from the balcony, a lathe and milling machine and other tools under the balcony, and still have room to work.  Congrats on yours,  EDMO

Edited by EDMO

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Posted

More progress!  We got three panels of roofing up on  each side, only 14 more to go (on each side).  The insulation is a MAJOR pain in the butt, but my plan to use ratchet straps across the purlins for it to roll on works well.  We did that on the starter roll, then decided to not use them on the next roll.  We'll be using them on the rest.......  It is also a really good idea to take the straps out BEFORE you screw down the panel, because of course one of the screws went right through the center of the strap.....

It is amazing to me how much my fear of heights has diminished.  When I started this every time the lift wiggled I was grabbing on in fear. Now I think I'd be halfway to the ground before I would panic if the thing fell over.  It helps the roof is basically flat, even wimpy me isn't uncomfortable walking on the panels we have up and secured.  It's only 1/12 pitch, so no real rolling off the roof if you slip worries.

 

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Posted

Could you use 550 cord or something like that to put up and roll it out on then just leave it in place?

Hoping this summer I will be building one as well on my own lil slice of heaven if all goes as planned!

:BC:

 

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Posted

Could you use 550 cord or something like that to put up and roll it out on then just leave it in place?

Hoping this summer I will be building one as well on my own lil slice of heaven if all goes as planned!

:BC:

 

That's a good idea.  Even if I don't leave it up there, it is a lot less likely to get stuck with a screw.  Doesn't need a lot of strength, just need to be able to pull it tight so it rolls easy.

Hopefully you have more time available, and more help than I do.  With 4 or 5 guys working full time, this building could probably be done in a month.  Many more than that, and they'd just be in each others way.

The roof would be more interesting, I bet you need a steeper roof than 1/12 up there in Snow country!

Mark

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Posted

Well I wish we would be getting the kind of snow we used to.. then I would be worried about it but for the last 10 yrs or so a flat roof would have held up just fine.  Snow does not have much of a chance to load up where I am buying at as its right on the edge of a nice river valley and the winds tend to blow the roofs clean :lol:

 

:BC:

 

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Posted

I don't know what shipping would be to Alaska, but I would recommend the company I bought it from - Durobeam.  Everything has fit the way it is supposed to.  Frame is straight and level, didn't need to shim, or yank it around with a come along to get it that way either.  Kudos to my concrete guy also - he put the anchor bolts in perfectly, and the slab is level.  No cracks on the slab or the apron, even with a 30,000 lb forklift running all over both of them.

Mark

 

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Posted

The paracord suggestion was a good one. I ordered a spool of 1,000 feet, and it arrived yesterday. We used it today.  It worked as well as the straps did for supporting the insulation to roll it out.  It isn't any faster to put up than the straps, but not having to take them out (especially if a screw goes through the strap - did that) and move them saves a ton of time.  By the time I get this hangar done, I'll know how to do this well.  I'll also know to let someone else do it next time :)  It has been a lot of fun though!

 

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Posted

Roof is done!  Front and rear trim to put on in the morning then the building is done, and on to the door!  Woo Hoo.  2 guys, 5 working days to do 2,500 square feet.

Mark

 

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Posted

The building is done! :BC:  Now on to the door.  

20180226_093554_small.jpg

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Posted

VERY NICE!

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Posted

Got the door support columns up and secured (concrete anchors at the bottom, welded to the from I-Beam at the top).  That was a royal b*tch.  18' long,  6" x 6 1/2" x 3/8" thick steel I-Beams with a 6+ foot hydraulic cylinder mounted on each of them.  That left about 2" of clearance at the top.  They weighed about 800lbs each, not something this computer nerd wants to do again anytime soon!

Hopefully the rest of the door will be done this weekend, and I can post videos of it going up and down next week!

Mark

 

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Posted

Spent several hours Sunday trying to get the door up.  Not the most fun I ever had, 16' x 45' x 4,000lbs of steel balanced on a reach forklift trying to fit it in place with what should be 1/4" clearance on either side.  Failed, it wouldn't fit, it was too wide.

I was pretty bummed, thought I must have messed up a measurement setting the columns, and had no idea how I would fix that.  After we got the door safely back on the ground, which was almost as difficult as getting it up in the first place, I started measuring things to see what I had messed up.

Turns out I didn't mess up after all.  After I measured the door, the pivot pin tube protrusions on the door and on the columns, the total width of the door was 45' 5/8"  The door opening is 44' 11 3/4" (have a +- 1/2", so within specs).  So I called the manufacturer Monday to see WTF was wrong.  The tube protrusions on each side of the door are supposed to be 1", they were 1 1/2" on one side, 1 5/8" on the other.  Combine that with the 1/4" narrow on the opening, and bingo, it is about 1" too wide.  Apparently the welder that put the tubes in the side supports didn't feel like measuring that day.

The manufacturer said I could cut the tube protrusion back to 1" on each side, which I'll do.  I'll also have to cut the pivot pins down also, probably 1/2" each, since the tubes are sized so the retention bolt keeps the pin in place - shorten the tube, shorten the pin.  The tubes won't be a big deal, the wall thickness is 3/16" at the most, but the pins are 2 1/2 or 3" solid steel.

I didn't use an bad words or yell at them, sh*t happens, and it is fixable.  However, I'll have to see what they'll offer me at Sun & Fun to keep quiet... :lmao: If I can get the 1/2" off each pin in one piece, I'll have see if I can make an appropriate medal they can present to the welder.

That !@#$% door is going up this Saturday!

Mark

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Posted

Awesome attitude, Mark!

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Posted (edited)

Mark,   How about renting or borrowing a big concrete saw with an abrasive blade to do the cutting with?  They cut thru some big rebars and bridge bolts with them.  EDMO

Edited by EDMO

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