Yamaha Apex Skytrax Adapters

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Posted

An update due here since Teal has now finished extensive ground testing (over the past few months) with this gearbox and now has it off to Steve Henry for flight testing.

Teal is also accepting deposits on gearboxes and I'll remind him to come in here and post up the details.

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Posted (edited)

An update due here since Teal has now finished extensive ground testing (over the past few months) with this gearbox and now has it off to Steve Henry for flight testing.

Teal is also accepting deposits on gearboxes and I'll remind him to come in here and post up the details.

I'm so excited about all this! It feels like I started looking into a Kitfox right at the right time. I've always felt there was a better, lighter, modern solution. Don't get me wrong, I loved the Lyc in my last plane and I love the big ass Continental in my Bo, but for something as light as an Avid variant this will be a game changer. I just want to thank Teal for the hard work and Yamma-Fox for keeping us updated! Against my better judgement I even made a facebook profile to be able to watch the progress there. I can't wait till I'm ready to get a Kitfox!

Edited by scruffy
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Posted

Yeah I also made up my facebook alais (Anatoli) for keeping in touch with this hobby ONLY.

Otherwise I really am an anti-FB guy too!

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Posted (edited)

Due an update here.  Teal has made a few upgrades to the original design, to include a larger oil reservoir, an oil level sight guage, and helical gears.

And bigger news (for anyone that has missed it) is that Edge Performance is working with Teal on a full zero timed Apex with beefed up internals and their fully automated aviation grade Turbo.

Edge should be testing a prototype here within the next two months and Steve Henry is planning to be the launch customer.

HP in testing will be in the 250-300 range.  Production units are planned to go out in a detuned range of 180-230 or so.

For reference, the Apex is run up to 600 HP in the snowmobile drag racing world.  Basically, Edge is planning to do all the internal upgrades (as seen in the pic below and website link) that are used for the 600 HP race sleds, but send it out to only run it in the 180-230 range for aircraft use.

http://www.powerbygns.com/Products.html  

Follow the Edge Performance build in the FB post here (click the "veiw on facebook" link)

 

 

 

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Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted

Reference post above, here is Thomas H's (Edge Performance) comments on the project:

It’s Yamaha time. I’ll try and keep this post alive as we progress. 

Step one is to tear down the engine and inspect and measure the internals. Ultrasonic clean and bead blast all parts. Send off all steel parts for tumbling and cadmium/zinc plating. 

Next, install forged pistons and rods, new bearings, ARP studs and MLS head gasket. 

Make a mil-spec Raychem DR-25 motorsport harness and adapt the Apex engine to our ECU. 

Make a 4-into-1, S321 turbo manifold and fit a Garrett turbo. Thinking either GT2860R or GT3071R. We’ll see how bald we dare to be. 

Fit Teal’s Sky-Trax PSRU 

Run it like we stole it on the test bench and dyno. Gain data and numbers. 

* Maybe do a full head job with full radius cut valve seats, grind the valves, and possibly a 5-axis CNC porting job. Needed, NO! Would it be cool, YES !

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Posted

I contacted GNS about their engines almost a year ago, Once he found out I was considering it for an airplane he hung up. I called him back and he explained he wants nothing to do with airplanes, doesn't want the liability. He is a pilot himself. He clammed up about even talking about it once he knew it was for a plane. Too bad, he has a lot of knowledge about the Yamaha engines and would be a good resource.

Yes, he pumps those Yamaha motors up to some incredible HP for sure.

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Posted

Hello all, Just a short update here. The Skytrax gearbox has been doing great during flight testing with only a few refinements that will be added to the production boxes like a sight level gauge snd slightly larger sump area. IF you didnt follow the Stol drag a few months back Steve Henry posted the second fastest time behind the 680hp turbine powered plane they call draco. In parrelel to Steves testing Thomas Hauklien of edge performance in Norway will start Dyno testing with a Turbo charged Apex. The goal is to get some 300hp sustained runs with and without the clutch and tear it down as nd measure and inspect parts. 

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Posted

Do you have a date on when you will have these gearboxes for sale?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Teal doesn't check in here as often as I do so I'll tell ya what he told me.   Edge should hopefully  be spinning up the turbo apex with this gearbox and a prop in Feb.   They will push it hard (300 HP) and test the heck out  of it.

Assuming success I think Teal would be ready to release the gearbox shortly thereafter.... so my SWAG guess would be late winter - early spring.

Below is the latest / updated gearbox design:

 

 

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Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted

Thanks for the info. I will be looking for more updates.  

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Posted (edited)

Just so that everyone has the opportunity that may not be on face book. We are collecting funds for a 3D scan of the Apex engine. This allows a digital representation of the engine for modeling and fitment purposes. If you would like a copy if the file it is $100 until we get 20 people to pitch in. We currently have 14 people signed up. If it goes over 20 people the cost will continue to come down as more pitch in. The cost is $2000. That includes the shipping both ways. Thomas Hauklien volunteered to send one of his engines out to do this. It is currently enroute to the vender.

Edited by Teal
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Posted (edited)

EDGE PERFORMANCE is about to spin up this gearbox on their 300 HP Aviation Apex.

This be an awesome test to prove out the entire setup, check for any weak links, and see if there is anything that needs beefing up or limits that need to be set.

The last 2 pics are physical comparisons of the Apex and the EP Rotax 912

 

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Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted

I am seriously starting to think about this engine for my Coyote.  I have not followed it as much as I should have so how about a quick down and dirty on the engine.

What am I looking at ready to bolt onto an engine mount for say a 150 HP package with the gear box?

I am pulling the trigger in the next few days for a CNC table and tubing cutter so knocking out engine mounts etc will be a breeze real soon.

:BC:

 

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Posted (edited)

Prelim guestimates on the EP Apex "EPeX" are outta my budget! 

An internally beefed up EPeX set up with big boost and HP will likely go north of $30k I'd bet.  But it'd be worth every penny if you wanted big power  because they basically do a major overhaul with top of the line internals and then their turbo and ecu is built to (experimental) aviation standards (as opposed to snowmo turbos) with built in protections to save the motor and get you home in case of detected detonation - overboost - overtemp (egt) - ect.

But really, wouldn't even $35k for say a 250 HP zero-timed Apex look pretty good next to an even more expensive 142 HP 915?

All that said, "MOST" people converting the apex are happy with the 150 stock NA motor.  Those doing that get everything done for under $10k in most cases:

$2500-3000 for a motor with all acessories from Jim Hensel (our top rated engine supplier) or DIY buying a used sled and canabalizing it.  (Shop a 2006-2010 Apex)  Contact Jim Hensel:  +16073298676

$3500 for the Skytrax adapter-gearbox.  Contact Teal Jenkins   +16237340185

$500 for the wire harness conversion (developed by Steve Henry and built by Ian Bange) Contact Ian Bange via Facebook: Precision Aviation Products (see pic below)

$1000 in incidentals

$1500 for a custom fit header (if not DIY).  Contact GP Headers:  https://www.gpheaders.com/products/custom-headers/

$900 for a Luga prop.

 

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Edited by Yamma-Fox
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Posted (edited)

Not sure why it would be that expensive considering you're starting with a 3-5K Apex engine? Edge Performance gets about 33k for their 154hp 912 turbo/FI motor. That's starting with a brand new crate 912 motor for ~20k. And they have to take it apart and do all the internals the same way...

Edited by CSCameron

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Posted (edited)

^^  Hope you are right!  What you say makes sense.

But I wouldn't entirely blame EP for seeking a premium for the big power they are offering in the EPeX.  220 - 300HP at a smidge less than 200 lbs total installed weight is pretty unheard of and probably worth a few bucks to the kind of people who really want that much power.

In terms of $/HP I think they would have grounds to look for a bigger margin.

Edited by Yamma-Fox

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Posted

Heck, I'd be happy if they could beef up and balance the internals, stick a turbo on the Apex motor and tune it for 180hp continuous. ;) I'd be elated if they could do that for 15-20k plus motor.

I'm not sure what they have to do to get the APEX to 300hp? Perhaps they're having to do a lot of machining on the block to get bigger pistons in there? I don't think they have to weld the crank like they do on the Rotax? Also, the Rotax doesn't come with fuel injection or a turbo so they are adding both of those as well as a big bore kit. I think the 154hp is good for the standard one minute and it drops back to 135hp continuous?

It will be very interesting to see how the APEX performs at 300hp and where the continuous output ends up. I hope it does well on both counts. I know many folks are sitting on the sidelines watching in great anticipation...

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Posted

Yep the 300 HP testbed is great to do some overload testing!  I really like the idea of that.  Assuming it does well there it would give some real comfort zone for running in that 180-220 HP range.

And for reference, the 300 is on OEM bore (998cc) and the stock crank as well.  The OEM crank is even used in the 600 HP Apex drag racing sleds.

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Posted

Just to give you guys an idea of what 300 hp does in a sled. The skidoo didn't even make it up the hill whereas the RX1 made a real good showing on what I would guess is at 10# of boost. The Apex comes up at probably 17-18 pounds of boost.    Ken..........

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